Police investigating incident between Killman, Rye-Sanders

A routine city council meeting went off the rails Tuesday when a quarrel at the council table escalated into an incident now under police investigation.

Around 9:05 p.m. Tuesday, shortly after the conclusion of the Carbondale City Council’s executive session, Carbondale Police and city staff “intervened in a verbal situation involving two council members and members of the public,” according to a statement from the city.

The confrontation was verbal in nature, and no one was injured. Police are investigating, and the matter will be forwarded to the state’s attorney’s office.

The situation began earlier in the evening in public view when Clare Killman called out Ginger Rye-Sanders at the council table. Rye-Sanders had questioned whether it was appropriate for another council member to vote on an ordinance he had helped to draft.

“To clear up all the dispersions that are coming from my left, drafting ordinance is our job,” Killman said. “It is what we are elected to do, and we are supposed to have ideas that we direct staff to implement. That is what we do. That is what being a legislator is, that is what we are elected to do. That we have to have a teach-in four years into someone’s term on the rudiments of their duties is beyond telling.”

Rye-Sanders clapped back just moments later, admonishing Killman for her recent public statements promoting secession.

“To the person on my right, I just want to say that I was asking a question because I had concerns about it to make sure that there was no problems with there being a conflict of interest,” Rye-Sanders said. “It’s amazing that it comes from someone who thinks that we're, that Illinois is supposed to be separated from the United States.”

Mayor Carolin Harvey quickly steered the meeting away from the council table and toward comments from the public.

“OK, so we're going to take this out to — I'm so glad to see all these faces here tonight,“ Harvey said.

The meeting moved on, but the conversation between Killman and Rye-Sanders continued privately. Rye-Sanders said Killman repeatedly called her a vulgar name and made threatening comments as the public looked on unaware.

The situation continued to escalate during the council’s subsequent executive session, which was closed to the public.

“I was the one being attacked,” Rye-Sanders told the Times on Thursday. “She considers herself a minority like me, and she attacks me?”

Killman, who is transgender, told the Times Thursday that acrimony between the two council members is “not a novel experience for us,” but what happened after the meeting as council members were leaving was entirely different.

“She had family waiting to jump me,” Killman said. “She had two family members trying to swing at me in the civic center lobby.”

Police and city staff quickly broke up the argument, and Killman said a city staff member brought her car to her out of concern the situation would further escalate in the parking lot.

Despite the wording in the city’s statement, Rye-Sanders insisted she was not physically in the building at the time of the incident. Killman disputed that.

“My family was there to get me to my car,” Rye-Sanders said. “I told them what happened, and I guess they came. That was my main focus, to get away.”

Police Chief and Interim City Manager Stan Reno declined to discuss the incident Wednesday, deferring to the city’s written statement.